Post by llecha on Aug 28, 2017 16:31:31 GMT -5
Posted by: Powerlille /CCCP/
There are two separated ways to get success in this game- to run KP fighters or non KP ones.
To run KP is much more easy. The main idea is- opponent should allow you to win rounds with jabs, being intimidated by possibility of getting stunned.
So you should just win rounds with jabs until he allows you to do this. And stun him if he becomes too agressive or starts to throw big punches.
For example, you may start with something like this:
1) 8/1/11 (outside)
and put this line after that:
2) if score < 0 then 5H/10/5 (counter)
Why? Cos if you lost round 1 he's too agressive (something like 7/6/7 or even 8/6/6), he landed very many punches, so probably his defence is low. Stun him. He can't have everything- good defense and great aggression in the same time, right?
Or/and:
2) if endurance_percent < 96 then 5H/10/5 (counter);
Why? Cos your fighter lost too much of endurance (more than 4% after one round- it's pretty much). What does it mean? Opponent goes with power punches, so he puts many point in power(something like 4B/9/6), so his defence is low- try to stun him.
These are two basic stun lines for KP-dancer.
Also you may use some random lines, like:
4) 5H/10/5 (counter)
There is no reason why it should be in round 4. But it makes you unpredictable. It's very important. Opponent must not read you. Sometimes you should go to the head in the very first round, your opps should be careful all the time knowing that you can do it in any round.
So you should randomize your FPs. You may go to the head in different rounds in different plans:
in the first one you may have this line for endurance:
3) if endurance_percent < 92 then 5H/10/5 (counter);
in another one:
4) if endurance_percent < 88 then 5H/10/5 (counter);
in third you may not have it at all.
In the first FP you may go to the head in round 2 if score < 0, in another one- in round 3 if score < 1 for example. Be variable.
Types of KP fighters.
I prefer to run tall KP-dancers with very light build. It allows me to use two good styles- outside for jabbing and counter for stunning. My type of KP-dancers barely can use allout style- their chins are too low for this- about 12-14. To use allot chins should be higher than 16.
Such a good chin- about 16-20, means that in fact you must use allout style for stunning, otherwise it's a waste of APs.
The shorter your opponent is the stronger he is. Fighting vs. strong fighters you should start the fight with low aggression- 6/1/13, 5/1/14. Strong fighters are not too good in scoring, they try to wear you out. The higher opp is the weaker he is. So you should start more agressive -7/1/12, 8/1/11. If his height is equal to yours then 9/1/10.
The longer your fight lasts the more and more aggressive you should fight. So if you start with 7/1/12, then in the end be ready to use 10/1/9 line in the end of the fight.
Some other lines you may use.
Don't forget about rest lines in your FPs:
if endurance_percent < 70 and score > 0 and round = 6 then 1/1/8 (outside)
KP-fighters always get tired faster than non-KPs. In general the main goal for non-KPs is to make you tired. If your fighter got tired- he's dead. Even the fact that KP and CHN are not reduced by fatigue, all other stats are and although you still have this "puncher's chance", most of times it won't work.
if hisstuns > 0 then
also a good line. If he was stunned before- it's possible, do it again!
Also you may cheat when stunning (+10%). It's worth it though you could be DQed for that:
5H/10!/5 (counter);
or
if .... and warnings = 0 then cheat;
after stunning line.
Fight plans.
The first and most important rule is- you should understand your FP. you should know every line in it and understand why it's here and how you want it to work. Don't create huge FPs which you barely can understand.
For example, KP-dancer vs. short slugger:
1) 5/1/14 (outside)
if score <= 0 then 6/1/14 (outside)
if round =3 and endurance_percent < 92 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round =4 and score < 2 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
#if round =4 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
#- this symbol deactivates the line, so you may use it to switch the line on/off or for some notes
6) 6/1/13 (outside)
if score <= 2 then 7/1/12 (outside)
if round =6 and score < 0 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round =7 and hisstuns > 0 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round = 6 and endurance_percent < 70 and score > 1 then 1/1/8 (outside)
if round = 8 and endurance_percent < 70 and score > 1 then 1/1/8 (outside)
9) 8/1/11 (outside)
if score <= 0 then 9/1/10 (outside)
if round =10 and hisstuns > 2 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round =12 and hisstuns > 1 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round = 11 and endurance_percent < 70 and score > 0 then 1/1/8 (outside)
Add some lines about towel and "the fight is won" in the end:
1) if score > (14 - round) then 4H/6/10 (counter);
1) if endurance_percent < 55 and score < 0 and opponent = 2 then towel;
Something like this. You should have an idea of FP, how you're going to win. Some logic, your own logic. It's simple.
DISCUSSION:
Posted by: Sanford BTP
Again by Albino- KP Guys
i start them at 12 str/4 kp, spd slightly higher than agl, 10-11 chin and just use them as flashers early. if they can't flash, they have the speed to win on points.
"hermione granger." is my latest and thats how she started. she's gone 18-0-0 since then thats my best undefeated streak. in regionals 9+k/2 is plenty because you can outskill everyone. 11 + k/2 is too keep round 1 flashing with allout viable. i am starting to change my opinion on this, especially with the number 15/5kp kp dancers around (tnts favourite). against those guys, they take your kp out of the game almost and you have to work their body or outslap them and its a bitch. use 1-2 less chin and you can more effectively wear them down or score more points. In contenders chin is a minimum of 13 for 7 kp guys. Lascivious had more spd than str and agl, 7 kp and 14 chin. Jimmy buffet has a whopping 16 chin and with his 14 cond it is almost impossible for him to take ips. Icemans hitman has 7 kp and 14 chin. Frady koo has 8 kp and 15 chin. Peekaboo memorial has 9 kp and 14 chin. Most of these guys have str almost equalled to agl. spd is lower by a few points on most. Peekaboo memorial is more of a kp slugger though, he can't really allout WT class managers.
Kp balanced
Lets a start with design:
There are two major types. Those with big chin and those without. I define big chin as CHN = 11 + KP/2. This amount of kp is ideal for going for round 1 KOs often with fighters that have 6 or more KP. Minimum chin for any fighter with 6 or more KP in contenders is 12.
Besides chin there are two different types:
Fighters with the SPD to slap or the STR and AGL to work the body.
It is paramount that you can fit your fighter into one of these two secondary groups, because if you can't and you can't flash KO either, then your fighter may as well be a punching bag.
To slap, your SPD need only be the average of the division and you would fight similar to that way a KP dancer would. if you lack SPD and have STR and AGL, you are more endurance efficient so you can work the body until your opponent is not hiding then you flash them. When they work the body they must be efficient because they are only more efficient by a small margin.
Conditioning:
The more SPD the less CND. This is obvious since you could use lower AGG to land the same number of punches and take less fatigue. The endurance optioned fighters need 17 CND so they can go 5B/7/8 and take no fatigue. 5 AGG should win the round against hide tactics which is very important. If you are losing the round the opponent doesn't have to change what they are doing. Unless you are gaining a large endurance advantage on them you are better winning the round. Normally if you are losing rounds though, you can successfully flash them.
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Posted by: Sanford BTP [Moderator] [Winner of 1 Invitational Title] [Winner of 35 Specialty Region Titles] [Winner of 267 Regional Titles] [Winner of 14 World Titles] [Winner of 14 World Titles]
Date: 2014-03-02 18:03 | IP: | Moderate This Post
Tactics:
Here is a sample of fp for the first 8 rounds (a kp fighter should have won by then) This would suit the speedier variety
1) 6/1/13 (outside);
if roundslost > 0 then 8/1/11 (outside);
if roundslost > 1 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 4H/10!/6 (allout);
if endurance_percent < 100 - (round - 1) * 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 4H/10!/6 (allout);
5) 7/1/12 (outside);
if score < 2 then 9/1/10 (outside);
if score < 1 then 11/1/8 (outside);
if score < 1 and endurance_percent > 80 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if score < 0 and endurance_percent > 80 then 5H/10!/5 (allout);
if round = 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if round = 6 and endurance_percent < 75 then 1/1/8 (outside);
if round = 7 and endurance_percent > 75 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if round = 8 and endurance_percent < 75 then 1/1/8 (outside);
9)...
It starts with slapping with 6 AGG. if you lose a round then you will slap harder. If you lose another round your opponent must be using pretty high AGG and must have low DEF (low enought for you at least) so you flash him. The endurance line is there to measure if your opponent is using 4B/8/8 or higher (so the '5' may not be a '5' in every matchup). If your opponent is using 4B/8/8 then you should be able to flash him.
From round 5 all AGG in slapping lines is increased by 1. This allows for fatigue and your opponent opening up to win rounds against you.This fp tries to maintain a large lead or 2 points. If your opponent is using enough AGG to beat you while you are going 9/1/10 (outside) then it will check your endurance and have a go at flashing him. There are only two ways for "if score < 0 and endurance_percent > 80 then 5H/10!/5 (allout)" to kick in. A) you didn't stun him - so allout... B) he stunned you more than you stunned him, but it is very unlikely you would still be above 80% in that instance. You may choose 85% to be safer or use additional conditionals but the likelyhood that line will kick in is quite low, it's mainly a slapper stopper.
"if round = 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 6H/11!/3 (feint)" is a nice line to close the box you put them in in the first rounds. In the first rounds you made sure they didn't win rounds and they didn't target your body, so they are either hiding or targeting the head. You know you were successful because this line only kicks in when there have been no stuns in the whole fight, if there where no stuns then you have contained them. This line is pre-emptive though and designed to catch them opening up because they have accomplished very little in the early rounds. for this reason you may choose to do this in round 6 instead of 5. two rest rounds follow. The round 6 rest is important because the pre-emptive flash line above it ensures a flash attempt occurs within the first 5 rounds, so if there is a round 6 there is a good possiblity that you are tired.
"if round = 7 and endurance_percent > 75 then 6H/11!/3 (feint)" is very useful, but also risky. by round 7 your opponent should have opened up and there is a good chance for a 10-8 round if not a KO but this would be you second flash and that leaves the possiblity of you being very tired after it if it doesn't win you the fight. even a 10-8 round could possibly win you enough points to go 1/1/18 for the remainder of the fight and still win.
Where does this leave the score?
Let us assume you won the first fours rounds and you didn't flash. Say you win round five 10-8 because of the flash and you rest in round 6. Say you win round seven 10-9 and you rest in round 8. You are then 5 points up with 4 rounds to go. If you lose round 7, you will only be 2 points up and if you flash and get a 10-8 round you are up by 6.
Let us assume you flashed in the early rounds based on endurance damage. The endurance line normally only kicks in, in round two, unless your opponent goes 6B/11/3 in round 2 or 3. Lets say they survive the f
Flashers
Written by Dover and Texas Cowboys:
*********************************
* How to optimize stun damage *
* The maths demonstration *
* Scroll down to the conclusions*
* if you're boared by this *
*********************************
The purpose of this is to create a "stun slugger" in order to maximize the stun damage he inflicts and minimize the stun damage he takes. And this for a predetermined number of total points.
First, build the "cost" function for it. Let's call it "C". C = Stun damage inflicted / Stun damage taken. And let's call "P" the number of "interesting" points.
C = (str + 3*kp)*(agl + chin - 11)*(spd)^1/2
P = str + kp + agl + spd + chn
Assuming that kp = str / 3 :
(1) C = (2*str)*(agl + chin - 11)*(spd)^1/2
(2) P = 4/3 str + agl + spd + chn
Equation (2) in equation (1) should eliminate either Str, Agl, Chin or Speed.Let's choose Chin. Whatever... It's the same.
(1') C = (2*str)*(agl+(P-4/3str-agl-spd)-11)*(spd)^1/2
And what do we have here ?? C depends only on Str, Spd and P.Agl naturally vanishes. How surprising.
(1') C = (2 str)*(P - 4/3 str - spd)*(spd)^1/2
You can write it this way :
(1str) C = [-8/3 str^2 + 2 str*(P-spd)]*(spd)^1/2
Or this way :
(1spd) C = [-(spd)^3/2+(P-4/3str)*(spd)^1/2]*(2 str)
Let's maximise this function :
d(C(str))
(a) --------- = (spd)^1/2 * [-16/3 str + 2*(P-Spd)] = 0
d(str)
(to maximise)
d(C(spd)) (b) --------- = (2str)*[-3/2*(spd)^1/2+1/2*(P-4/3str)*(spd)^-1/2] = 0
d(spd)
I won't detail (?!) here, but here are the results :
(a) Str + 3/8Spd= 3/8P
(b) Spd + 4/9Str= 1/3P
Now let's do (a) - 3/8 (b) = (c)
(c) [Str = 3/10 * P] and [Spd = 1/5*P]
**************
* Conclusion *
**************
If you want to maximise your stun damage and minimize his stun damage. For a total points of 80. With, for example 18 Height, 1 Cut, and 5 Cnd.
P = 80 - 18 - 1 - 5 = 56.
Your fighter must have Str = 16.8.
We assumed earlier that Str = 3*Kp => Str = 15 Kp = 5
And Spd = 11.2. => Spd = 11
Bonus conclusion : No matter what Agl and Chin are as long as Chin+Agl matches the resting points.
Here 56-15-5-11 = 25.
Choose a Chin of 20 and a Agl of 5, or a Chin of 15 and an agility of 10.
The only thing to do to know if Agl 20 Chin 5 is better than Agl 5 Chin 20 is to compute the style and weight bonuses. A flasher needs to be as close as 300 pounds as can be, in order for his opponent not to have any weight bonus. But also to avoid useless > 300 pounds fatigue.
So here's the best stun damage killer with height 6"6, Low Cuts, and Cond 5.
STR 15 KP 5
SPD 11 AGL 5
CHIN 20 CND 5
Build : A little heavy (299 pounds)
Cuts 1
Height 18 (6"6)
Note that Chin + Agl must be equal to 23 whatever they are. Here, I chose Agl in order to weigh in at 298 pounds.
All the infos given here are true, whatever the result of this contest was. This is how you can optimize your fighters.
PS 1 : This thing is implemented in my VB FCTv1.2. But writing this, I wonder why I didn't come up with this fighter ?! I have to fix some bug here
PS 2 : This demonstration also works for End Damage (O Kp) sluggers. This was originally posted by Duke in the design forum about one year ago.
MORE.... by Texas Cowboys
The ratio (Stun damage/chin) is what determines knockouts:
1.5 = stun
2.0 = knockdown
2.5 = knockout (see complete rules for details on this)
You need to minimize this, and here is my proof that agility is effectively meaningless in reducing your stuns:
stn dmg/chin = opp_pow*(opp_str+3*opp_KP)*sqrrt(opp_agg*opp*spd)/ (agl + chin - 11) * chin
since you can't control the opponent stats, reduce the top to some opponent stun factor divided by (agl + chin - 11) * chin.
you want to minimize the stn dmg/chin, and since you can't control the opponent's stun factor you need to maximize the stuff on the bottom:
[agl+chin-11]*chin, which becomes: [chin^2 + agl*chin - 11*chin]
to maximize that equation, you want chin to be as high as possible because it is squared, which will dominate the direction of the equation. since agility and chin are mutually exclusive.... YOU SHOULD PUT ALL OF YOUR AGILITY TOWARD YOUR CHIN TO MAXIMIZE YOUR STUN DEFENSE.
The only exception to this is poorly conditioned flashers, overweight as hell, with agl < 4 that are taking **HUGE** amounts of endurance damage and are basically suffering from the new fatigue hack.
I was trying to tell him that the chin threshold means agility is still important and should be about 2/3 chin... hehe.. and then i did the above math, and found myself to be the fool
that damn squared chin--i forgot it was in the bottom of the stupid stun damage equation as an offset of agilty - 11.. I don't think bruce ever intended that.. it was only to keep people a little honest i think (chin around 10), but it's the chin^2 factor that causes problems... you take the equation:
chin^2 + chin*agl - 11*chin
force agility + chin = 30 (for argument sake.. could be 10, 20, whatever APs you have left from the other stats... anyway, the two add up to some number)
chin^2 +chin*(30-chin) - 11*chin
chin^2 +30chin - chin^2 - 11*chin
30chin - 11*chin
to maximize that.. make chin as big as possible! so i guess, and I just realized this right now.. if you have at least 12 points to distribute among chin and agility... put them all toward chin. hmm.. interesting
Flashers, Written by Mr. T:
Basicly I just followed Albino's rules, he knows the formulas a lot better than I. I never knew why he wasn't more successful with them.
Anyway:
1/3 Str = kp : Obviously, max your kp.
Speed = 2/3 Str: The max damage formula I believe is speed * 2.5 = str, so 2/3 is a pretty good comprimise. By going inside you gain strengh, so if you have exactly 2.5 you are going to lose efficiency. Bremen liked his speed higher because he used inside A LOT more than I did.
Chin = Speed: My preference. Higher chin allows you to use more power, lower chin makes you use less.
Agility (start) = 11: The lowest agility without risking weight problems. Agility doesn't help much and the points that you use in it should be in chin. However, if I gained a few random points in it I kept them.
Condition (start) = 6, <= 10: I used 6 to start because I knew I would always get a few randoms. I usually ended up with 10 by 28 status. I often went more than a couple of rounds with my successful flashers. I found that I could frustrate managers by destroying their drone 1/1/18 fight plans by outscoring them a few rounds. Plus it looks good for your ko ratio if you win a few decisions.
VH, low cuts. : I might try a lighter build now with counter being used more.
Flashers, Written by Albino:
FLASHERS: upside - quick & easy to manage and will usually only have short fps.
downside - one dimensional and cannot easily beat all fighter types. very difficult to beat fighters with KP and/or good CHN.
favored opponent - any fighter with low KP or low CHN
feared opponent - KP slugger, KP balanced
example fp-
1) 5H/11!/4 (inside);
2) 5H/11!/4 (allout);
2) towel;
towel will only kick in when you have less than 50% endurance. the more CND the more detail the fp can have.
how to make flashers:
30% STR, 10% KP, 20% SPD, 22% CHN, 18% AGL is a good distrubution (after you've designated height, cuts and CND. i like to start with about 6 CND, cuts always low. build will effect the average height of opponents (the taller they are the more 'counter' will hurt you), but i have no build preferance for flashers.
with any fighter you create, they don't have to be efficient till at least contenders. you can usually rely on the fact that most of your opponents will be easy to beat, so the efficient stats above don't necessarily have to be used. early in a flashers career he won't need a large CHN or high CND. CHN does have a limited effectiveness, after about 17-18 CHN you can absorb around 50% more stun damage than your opponent (if they have 11-12 CHN), after that you need to increase AGL to limit endurance damage and decrease opponents AGL advantage. later in the career a flasher he could have more AGL than CHN, the only exception being heavyweights. managing flashers:
--flashers vs flashers: its always tough when fighting you're own fighter type. if you have the better flasher, ie everything is in better proportions and/or your status is higher (more aps) then the less efficient you have to be. ultimately it's a guessing game, he can hide (1/1/18), play defensive (3H/6/11), be efficient (4H/8/8) or go aggressive (5H/10/5). you have to try guess what he will do, if he hides allout would be needed to KO him, but you don't want to allout a flasher; if he goes efficient then you will probably need to go efficient also. if you can cover his defensive & efficient option at the same time then you should win. inside will reduce your defences, so don't use it unless you have 5 point advantage or so. instead, if you have a SPD advantage use feint, if you don't then ring is probably your best option. ring may give you more fatigue, but the stun damage reduction at flasher damage levels is significant.
other options/tactics- working the body to tire your CND challenged opponent, eg 2B/3/15 or 3B/6/11. after 4 rounds or so he'll be tired enough for you to just go efficiently, and once he's tired you can't lose.
in heavyweights, weight advantage is a huge factor as CHN is the most important stat in flasher vs flasher matchups. without weight advantage you have less fatigue, using 2B/7/11 (using lower AGG to further reduce fatigue) till they tire may cause experienced managers to bail when their towel conditional unexpectedly kicks in from body damage and not fatigue.
--flashers vs KP dancers: you must be very careful, allout is a good option vs fighters with KP <= 2. after that though, allout can be beaten with an efficient counter. using inside is safer- but if they hide then you may not quite cause enough damage. this is when a calculator comes in handy, pure flashers are very mathematical to manage imo. if your allout can cover his 4H/6/10 (counter) tactic use allout then, only a very cunning opponent will use 4H/8/8 (counter) since 8 DEF is relatively easy to KO with inside. other options/tactics- hide or rest until you think he will open up, then KO him.
other options/tactics- if you have SPD => 15 and CND => 8 and you think he will hide then rest-dancing is an option. 6/2/5 (clinch) could win rounds while the rest points will help you hang around. after a few rounds your opponent will probably open up to KO a suspected tired opponent or in AGG to tak
Typical development for a 5'8" KP Balanced fighting in Super Welterweight (153 lbs). Main text by Albino.
STATUS 0
A new fighter
STR 10 KP 3
SPD 12 AGL 12
CHN 11 CND 13
STATUS 6
Low regional
STR 11 KP 3
SPD 13 AGL 15
CHN 12 CND 14
STATUS 12
Middle regional
STR 13 KP 4
SPD 16 AGL 17
CHN 13 CND 14
STATUS 18
High regional
STR 15 KP 5
SPD 18 AGL 19
CHN 15 CND 15
STATUS 24
Middle contender
STR 17 KP 5
SPD 21 AGL 22
CHN 15 CND 16
CHAMPION
of the world
STR 18 KP 6
SPD 22 AGL 24
CHN 16 CND 16
KP Balanced
Lets a start with design:
There are two major types. the ones will big chin and the ones without. I define big chin as CHN = 11 + KP/2. This amount of kp is ideal for going for round 1 KOs often with fighters that have 6 or more KP. Minimum chin for any fighter with 6 or more KP in contenders is 12.
After chin there are two different types:
The ones with SPD to slap or STR and AGL to work the body. It is paramount that you can fit your fighter into one of these two secondary groups, because if you can't and you can't flash KO either, then your fighter may as well be a punching bag. To slap, you SPD need only be the average of the division and you would fight similar to that way a KP dancer would. if you lack SPD and have STR and AGL, you are more endurance efficient so you can work the body until your opponent is not hiding then you flash them. When they work the body they must be efficient because they are only more efficient by a small margin.
Conditioning:
The more SPD the less CND. This is obvious since you could use lower AGG to land the same number of punches and take less fatigue. The endurance optioned fighters need 17 CND so they can go 5B/7/8 and take no fatigue. 5 AGG should win the round against hide tactics which is very important. If you are losing the round the opponent doesn't have to change what they are doing. Unless you are gaining a large endurance advantage on them you better win the round. Normally if you are losing rounds though, you can successfully flash them.
Instant Fight Plans (Not instant yet, you will have to Cut&Paste for the time being)
Tactics: Heres a sample of fp for the first 8 rounds (a kp fighter should have won by then). This would suit the speedier variety:
1) 6/1/13 (outside);
if roundslost > 0 then 8/1/11 (outside);
if roundslost > 1 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 4H/10!/6 (allout);
if endurance_percent < 100 - (round - 1) * 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 4H/10!/6 (allout);
5) 7/1/12 (outside);
if score < 2 then 9/1/10 (outside);
if score < 1 then 11/1/8 (outside);
if score < 1 and endurance_percent > 80 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if score < 0 and endurance_percent > 80 then 5H/10!/5 (allout);
if round = 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if round = 6 and endurance_percent < 75 then 1/1/8 (outside);
if round = 7 and endurance_percent > 75 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if round = 8 and endurance_percent < 75 then 1/1/8 (outside);
9)...
Its starts with slapping with 6 AGG. If you lose a round then you will slap harder. If you lose another round your opponent must be using pretty high AGG and must have low DEF (low enought for you at least) so you flash him. The endurance line is there to measure if your opponent is using 4B/8/8 or higher (so the '5' may not be a '5' in every matchup). If your opponent is using 4B/8/8 then you should be able to flash him.
From round 5 all AGG in slapping lines is increased by 1. This allows for fatigue and your opponent opening up to win rounds against you. This fp tries to maintain a large lead or 2 points. If your opponent is using enough AGG to beat you while you are going 9/1/10 (outside) then it will check your endurance and have a go at flashing him.
There are only two ways for "if score < 0 and endurance_percent > 80 then 5H/10!/5 (allout)" to kick in.
A) you didn't stun him - so allout...
B) he stunned you more than you stunned him, but it is very unlikely you would still be above 80% in that instance.
You may choose 85% to be safer or use additional conditionals but the likelyhood that line will kick is quite low, it's mainly a slapper stopper.
"if round = 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 6H/11!/3 (feint)" is a nice line to close the box you put them in in the first rounds. In the first rounds you made sure they didn't win rounds and they didn't target your body, so they are either hiding or targeting the head. You know you were successful because this line only kicks in when there have been no stuns in the whole fight, if there where no stuns then you have contained them. This line is pre-emptive though and designed to catch them opening up because they have accomplished very little in the early rounds. For this reason you may choose to do this in round 6 instead of 5.
Two rest rounds follow. The round 6 rest is important because the pre-emptive flash line above it ensures a flash attempt occurs within the first 5 rounds, so if there is a round 6 there is a good possiblity that you are tired. "if round = 7 and endurance_percent > 75 then 6H/11!/3 (feint)" is very useful, but also risky. By round 7 your opponent should have opened up and there is a good chance for a 10-8 round if not a KO but this would be you second flash and that leaves the possiblity of you being very tired after it if it doesn't win you the fight. Even a 10-8 round could possibly win you enough points to go 1/1/18 for the remainder of the fight and still win.
Where does this leave the score? Let's assume you won the first fours rounds and you didn't flash. Say you win round five 10-8 because of the flash and you rest in round 6. Say you win round seven 10-9 and you rest in round 8. You are then 5 points up with 4 rounds to go. If you lose round 7, you will only be 2 points up and if you flash and get a 10-8 round you are up by 6.
Now lets assume you flashed in the early rounds based on endurance damage. The endurance line normally only kicks in in round two unless your opponent goes 6B/11/3 in round 2 or 3. Let's say they survive the flash somehow and you only win the round 10-8. you will go 6/1/13 until you lose a round and you will still open up and go 8/1/11. So let's say you lose an erly round too. You should be up by 3. The pre-emptive flash doesnt happen and you go 7/1/12. Say you win that round and the opponent opens up the next round and you need to rest. The score is still 3. Your opponent is winning rounds so the round 7 flash would be great to have here but say you don't and you still go 7/1/12 and draw the round. In round 8, you aren't tired enough so you slap again. you still have a decent lead.
Keep in mind any of these 10-8 rounds could have resulted in a KO victory, I was just showing where it leaves you if you couldn't KO them. It leaves you in the lead.
So you see this fp works best against the conservitive while being conservitive itself. All flash lines are only triggered when it is determined their DEF must be low, except for the pre-emptive flash in round 5 which only serves to catch the conservative. The radical will normally fall victim to the round 7 flash because by that time they have gambled and opened up to try and win the fight and left their DEF low. They may use stun checks and not expect a second flash.
Posted by: Powerlille /CCCP/
Thanks, Sanford. We will move all this to the new site soon.
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Posted by: Vault 13
I think alot of this is uncomprehensible for the regular rookie
Posted by: Powerlille /CCCP/
yyyyyyyep
Posted by: Jimmy the Harp (Little Gym)
"PS 2 : This demonstration also works for End Damage (O Kp) sluggers. This was originally posted by Duke in the design forum about one year ago"
Can anyone explain what he means that this also works for 0 kp sluggers? I don't understand what this stun efficiency formula has to do with 0 kp sluggers...
Posted by: SIN <Evil Empire>
I think what it is trying to say is that calculating endurance damage for 0kp sluggers is basically the same as calculating stun damage for kp sluggers.
Endurance damage is basically calculated the same as stun damage except in stun damage kp (and targeting) plays a factor.
There are two separated ways to get success in this game- to run KP fighters or non KP ones.
To run KP is much more easy. The main idea is- opponent should allow you to win rounds with jabs, being intimidated by possibility of getting stunned.
So you should just win rounds with jabs until he allows you to do this. And stun him if he becomes too agressive or starts to throw big punches.
For example, you may start with something like this:
1) 8/1/11 (outside)
and put this line after that:
2) if score < 0 then 5H/10/5 (counter)
Why? Cos if you lost round 1 he's too agressive (something like 7/6/7 or even 8/6/6), he landed very many punches, so probably his defence is low. Stun him. He can't have everything- good defense and great aggression in the same time, right?
Or/and:
2) if endurance_percent < 96 then 5H/10/5 (counter);
Why? Cos your fighter lost too much of endurance (more than 4% after one round- it's pretty much). What does it mean? Opponent goes with power punches, so he puts many point in power(something like 4B/9/6), so his defence is low- try to stun him.
These are two basic stun lines for KP-dancer.
Also you may use some random lines, like:
4) 5H/10/5 (counter)
There is no reason why it should be in round 4. But it makes you unpredictable. It's very important. Opponent must not read you. Sometimes you should go to the head in the very first round, your opps should be careful all the time knowing that you can do it in any round.
So you should randomize your FPs. You may go to the head in different rounds in different plans:
in the first one you may have this line for endurance:
3) if endurance_percent < 92 then 5H/10/5 (counter);
in another one:
4) if endurance_percent < 88 then 5H/10/5 (counter);
in third you may not have it at all.
In the first FP you may go to the head in round 2 if score < 0, in another one- in round 3 if score < 1 for example. Be variable.
Types of KP fighters.
I prefer to run tall KP-dancers with very light build. It allows me to use two good styles- outside for jabbing and counter for stunning. My type of KP-dancers barely can use allout style- their chins are too low for this- about 12-14. To use allot chins should be higher than 16.
Such a good chin- about 16-20, means that in fact you must use allout style for stunning, otherwise it's a waste of APs.
The shorter your opponent is the stronger he is. Fighting vs. strong fighters you should start the fight with low aggression- 6/1/13, 5/1/14. Strong fighters are not too good in scoring, they try to wear you out. The higher opp is the weaker he is. So you should start more agressive -7/1/12, 8/1/11. If his height is equal to yours then 9/1/10.
The longer your fight lasts the more and more aggressive you should fight. So if you start with 7/1/12, then in the end be ready to use 10/1/9 line in the end of the fight.
Some other lines you may use.
Don't forget about rest lines in your FPs:
if endurance_percent < 70 and score > 0 and round = 6 then 1/1/8 (outside)
KP-fighters always get tired faster than non-KPs. In general the main goal for non-KPs is to make you tired. If your fighter got tired- he's dead. Even the fact that KP and CHN are not reduced by fatigue, all other stats are and although you still have this "puncher's chance", most of times it won't work.
if hisstuns > 0 then
also a good line. If he was stunned before- it's possible, do it again!
Also you may cheat when stunning (+10%). It's worth it though you could be DQed for that:
5H/10!/5 (counter);
or
if .... and warnings = 0 then cheat;
after stunning line.
Fight plans.
The first and most important rule is- you should understand your FP. you should know every line in it and understand why it's here and how you want it to work. Don't create huge FPs which you barely can understand.
For example, KP-dancer vs. short slugger:
1) 5/1/14 (outside)
if score <= 0 then 6/1/14 (outside)
if round =3 and endurance_percent < 92 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round =4 and score < 2 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
#if round =4 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
#- this symbol deactivates the line, so you may use it to switch the line on/off or for some notes
6) 6/1/13 (outside)
if score <= 2 then 7/1/12 (outside)
if round =6 and score < 0 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round =7 and hisstuns > 0 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round = 6 and endurance_percent < 70 and score > 1 then 1/1/8 (outside)
if round = 8 and endurance_percent < 70 and score > 1 then 1/1/8 (outside)
9) 8/1/11 (outside)
if score <= 0 then 9/1/10 (outside)
if round =10 and hisstuns > 2 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round =12 and hisstuns > 1 then 5H/10!/5 (counter);
if round = 11 and endurance_percent < 70 and score > 0 then 1/1/8 (outside)
Add some lines about towel and "the fight is won" in the end:
1) if score > (14 - round) then 4H/6/10 (counter);
1) if endurance_percent < 55 and score < 0 and opponent = 2 then towel;
Something like this. You should have an idea of FP, how you're going to win. Some logic, your own logic. It's simple.
DISCUSSION:
Posted by: Sanford BTP
Again by Albino- KP Guys
i start them at 12 str/4 kp, spd slightly higher than agl, 10-11 chin and just use them as flashers early. if they can't flash, they have the speed to win on points.
"hermione granger." is my latest and thats how she started. she's gone 18-0-0 since then thats my best undefeated streak. in regionals 9+k/2 is plenty because you can outskill everyone. 11 + k/2 is too keep round 1 flashing with allout viable. i am starting to change my opinion on this, especially with the number 15/5kp kp dancers around (tnts favourite). against those guys, they take your kp out of the game almost and you have to work their body or outslap them and its a bitch. use 1-2 less chin and you can more effectively wear them down or score more points. In contenders chin is a minimum of 13 for 7 kp guys. Lascivious had more spd than str and agl, 7 kp and 14 chin. Jimmy buffet has a whopping 16 chin and with his 14 cond it is almost impossible for him to take ips. Icemans hitman has 7 kp and 14 chin. Frady koo has 8 kp and 15 chin. Peekaboo memorial has 9 kp and 14 chin. Most of these guys have str almost equalled to agl. spd is lower by a few points on most. Peekaboo memorial is more of a kp slugger though, he can't really allout WT class managers.
Kp balanced
Lets a start with design:
There are two major types. Those with big chin and those without. I define big chin as CHN = 11 + KP/2. This amount of kp is ideal for going for round 1 KOs often with fighters that have 6 or more KP. Minimum chin for any fighter with 6 or more KP in contenders is 12.
Besides chin there are two different types:
Fighters with the SPD to slap or the STR and AGL to work the body.
It is paramount that you can fit your fighter into one of these two secondary groups, because if you can't and you can't flash KO either, then your fighter may as well be a punching bag.
To slap, your SPD need only be the average of the division and you would fight similar to that way a KP dancer would. if you lack SPD and have STR and AGL, you are more endurance efficient so you can work the body until your opponent is not hiding then you flash them. When they work the body they must be efficient because they are only more efficient by a small margin.
Conditioning:
The more SPD the less CND. This is obvious since you could use lower AGG to land the same number of punches and take less fatigue. The endurance optioned fighters need 17 CND so they can go 5B/7/8 and take no fatigue. 5 AGG should win the round against hide tactics which is very important. If you are losing the round the opponent doesn't have to change what they are doing. Unless you are gaining a large endurance advantage on them you are better winning the round. Normally if you are losing rounds though, you can successfully flash them.
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Posted by: Sanford BTP [Moderator] [Winner of 1 Invitational Title] [Winner of 35 Specialty Region Titles] [Winner of 267 Regional Titles] [Winner of 14 World Titles] [Winner of 14 World Titles]
Date: 2014-03-02 18:03 | IP: | Moderate This Post
Tactics:
Here is a sample of fp for the first 8 rounds (a kp fighter should have won by then) This would suit the speedier variety
1) 6/1/13 (outside);
if roundslost > 0 then 8/1/11 (outside);
if roundslost > 1 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 4H/10!/6 (allout);
if endurance_percent < 100 - (round - 1) * 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 4H/10!/6 (allout);
5) 7/1/12 (outside);
if score < 2 then 9/1/10 (outside);
if score < 1 then 11/1/8 (outside);
if score < 1 and endurance_percent > 80 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if score < 0 and endurance_percent > 80 then 5H/10!/5 (allout);
if round = 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if round = 6 and endurance_percent < 75 then 1/1/8 (outside);
if round = 7 and endurance_percent > 75 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if round = 8 and endurance_percent < 75 then 1/1/8 (outside);
9)...
It starts with slapping with 6 AGG. if you lose a round then you will slap harder. If you lose another round your opponent must be using pretty high AGG and must have low DEF (low enought for you at least) so you flash him. The endurance line is there to measure if your opponent is using 4B/8/8 or higher (so the '5' may not be a '5' in every matchup). If your opponent is using 4B/8/8 then you should be able to flash him.
From round 5 all AGG in slapping lines is increased by 1. This allows for fatigue and your opponent opening up to win rounds against you.This fp tries to maintain a large lead or 2 points. If your opponent is using enough AGG to beat you while you are going 9/1/10 (outside) then it will check your endurance and have a go at flashing him. There are only two ways for "if score < 0 and endurance_percent > 80 then 5H/10!/5 (allout)" to kick in. A) you didn't stun him - so allout... B) he stunned you more than you stunned him, but it is very unlikely you would still be above 80% in that instance. You may choose 85% to be safer or use additional conditionals but the likelyhood that line will kick in is quite low, it's mainly a slapper stopper.
"if round = 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 6H/11!/3 (feint)" is a nice line to close the box you put them in in the first rounds. In the first rounds you made sure they didn't win rounds and they didn't target your body, so they are either hiding or targeting the head. You know you were successful because this line only kicks in when there have been no stuns in the whole fight, if there where no stuns then you have contained them. This line is pre-emptive though and designed to catch them opening up because they have accomplished very little in the early rounds. for this reason you may choose to do this in round 6 instead of 5. two rest rounds follow. The round 6 rest is important because the pre-emptive flash line above it ensures a flash attempt occurs within the first 5 rounds, so if there is a round 6 there is a good possiblity that you are tired.
"if round = 7 and endurance_percent > 75 then 6H/11!/3 (feint)" is very useful, but also risky. by round 7 your opponent should have opened up and there is a good chance for a 10-8 round if not a KO but this would be you second flash and that leaves the possiblity of you being very tired after it if it doesn't win you the fight. even a 10-8 round could possibly win you enough points to go 1/1/18 for the remainder of the fight and still win.
Where does this leave the score?
Let us assume you won the first fours rounds and you didn't flash. Say you win round five 10-8 because of the flash and you rest in round 6. Say you win round seven 10-9 and you rest in round 8. You are then 5 points up with 4 rounds to go. If you lose round 7, you will only be 2 points up and if you flash and get a 10-8 round you are up by 6.
Let us assume you flashed in the early rounds based on endurance damage. The endurance line normally only kicks in, in round two, unless your opponent goes 6B/11/3 in round 2 or 3. Lets say they survive the f
Flashers
Written by Dover and Texas Cowboys:
*********************************
* How to optimize stun damage *
* The maths demonstration *
* Scroll down to the conclusions*
* if you're boared by this *
*********************************
The purpose of this is to create a "stun slugger" in order to maximize the stun damage he inflicts and minimize the stun damage he takes. And this for a predetermined number of total points.
First, build the "cost" function for it. Let's call it "C". C = Stun damage inflicted / Stun damage taken. And let's call "P" the number of "interesting" points.
C = (str + 3*kp)*(agl + chin - 11)*(spd)^1/2
P = str + kp + agl + spd + chn
Assuming that kp = str / 3 :
(1) C = (2*str)*(agl + chin - 11)*(spd)^1/2
(2) P = 4/3 str + agl + spd + chn
Equation (2) in equation (1) should eliminate either Str, Agl, Chin or Speed.Let's choose Chin. Whatever... It's the same.
(1') C = (2*str)*(agl+(P-4/3str-agl-spd)-11)*(spd)^1/2
And what do we have here ?? C depends only on Str, Spd and P.Agl naturally vanishes. How surprising.
(1') C = (2 str)*(P - 4/3 str - spd)*(spd)^1/2
You can write it this way :
(1str) C = [-8/3 str^2 + 2 str*(P-spd)]*(spd)^1/2
Or this way :
(1spd) C = [-(spd)^3/2+(P-4/3str)*(spd)^1/2]*(2 str)
Let's maximise this function :
d(C(str))
(a) --------- = (spd)^1/2 * [-16/3 str + 2*(P-Spd)] = 0
d(str)
(to maximise)
d(C(spd)) (b) --------- = (2str)*[-3/2*(spd)^1/2+1/2*(P-4/3str)*(spd)^-1/2] = 0
d(spd)
I won't detail (?!) here, but here are the results :
(a) Str + 3/8Spd= 3/8P
(b) Spd + 4/9Str= 1/3P
Now let's do (a) - 3/8 (b) = (c)
(c) [Str = 3/10 * P] and [Spd = 1/5*P]
**************
* Conclusion *
**************
If you want to maximise your stun damage and minimize his stun damage. For a total points of 80. With, for example 18 Height, 1 Cut, and 5 Cnd.
P = 80 - 18 - 1 - 5 = 56.
Your fighter must have Str = 16.8.
We assumed earlier that Str = 3*Kp => Str = 15 Kp = 5
And Spd = 11.2. => Spd = 11
Bonus conclusion : No matter what Agl and Chin are as long as Chin+Agl matches the resting points.
Here 56-15-5-11 = 25.
Choose a Chin of 20 and a Agl of 5, or a Chin of 15 and an agility of 10.
The only thing to do to know if Agl 20 Chin 5 is better than Agl 5 Chin 20 is to compute the style and weight bonuses. A flasher needs to be as close as 300 pounds as can be, in order for his opponent not to have any weight bonus. But also to avoid useless > 300 pounds fatigue.
So here's the best stun damage killer with height 6"6, Low Cuts, and Cond 5.
STR 15 KP 5
SPD 11 AGL 5
CHIN 20 CND 5
Build : A little heavy (299 pounds)
Cuts 1
Height 18 (6"6)
Note that Chin + Agl must be equal to 23 whatever they are. Here, I chose Agl in order to weigh in at 298 pounds.
All the infos given here are true, whatever the result of this contest was. This is how you can optimize your fighters.
PS 1 : This thing is implemented in my VB FCTv1.2. But writing this, I wonder why I didn't come up with this fighter ?! I have to fix some bug here
PS 2 : This demonstration also works for End Damage (O Kp) sluggers. This was originally posted by Duke in the design forum about one year ago.
MORE.... by Texas Cowboys
The ratio (Stun damage/chin) is what determines knockouts:
1.5 = stun
2.0 = knockdown
2.5 = knockout (see complete rules for details on this)
You need to minimize this, and here is my proof that agility is effectively meaningless in reducing your stuns:
stn dmg/chin = opp_pow*(opp_str+3*opp_KP)*sqrrt(opp_agg*opp*spd)/ (agl + chin - 11) * chin
since you can't control the opponent stats, reduce the top to some opponent stun factor divided by (agl + chin - 11) * chin.
you want to minimize the stn dmg/chin, and since you can't control the opponent's stun factor you need to maximize the stuff on the bottom:
[agl+chin-11]*chin, which becomes: [chin^2 + agl*chin - 11*chin]
to maximize that equation, you want chin to be as high as possible because it is squared, which will dominate the direction of the equation. since agility and chin are mutually exclusive.... YOU SHOULD PUT ALL OF YOUR AGILITY TOWARD YOUR CHIN TO MAXIMIZE YOUR STUN DEFENSE.
The only exception to this is poorly conditioned flashers, overweight as hell, with agl < 4 that are taking **HUGE** amounts of endurance damage and are basically suffering from the new fatigue hack.
I was trying to tell him that the chin threshold means agility is still important and should be about 2/3 chin... hehe.. and then i did the above math, and found myself to be the fool
that damn squared chin--i forgot it was in the bottom of the stupid stun damage equation as an offset of agilty - 11.. I don't think bruce ever intended that.. it was only to keep people a little honest i think (chin around 10), but it's the chin^2 factor that causes problems... you take the equation:
chin^2 + chin*agl - 11*chin
force agility + chin = 30 (for argument sake.. could be 10, 20, whatever APs you have left from the other stats... anyway, the two add up to some number)
chin^2 +chin*(30-chin) - 11*chin
chin^2 +30chin - chin^2 - 11*chin
30chin - 11*chin
to maximize that.. make chin as big as possible! so i guess, and I just realized this right now.. if you have at least 12 points to distribute among chin and agility... put them all toward chin. hmm.. interesting
Flashers, Written by Mr. T:
Basicly I just followed Albino's rules, he knows the formulas a lot better than I. I never knew why he wasn't more successful with them.
Anyway:
1/3 Str = kp : Obviously, max your kp.
Speed = 2/3 Str: The max damage formula I believe is speed * 2.5 = str, so 2/3 is a pretty good comprimise. By going inside you gain strengh, so if you have exactly 2.5 you are going to lose efficiency. Bremen liked his speed higher because he used inside A LOT more than I did.
Chin = Speed: My preference. Higher chin allows you to use more power, lower chin makes you use less.
Agility (start) = 11: The lowest agility without risking weight problems. Agility doesn't help much and the points that you use in it should be in chin. However, if I gained a few random points in it I kept them.
Condition (start) = 6, <= 10: I used 6 to start because I knew I would always get a few randoms. I usually ended up with 10 by 28 status. I often went more than a couple of rounds with my successful flashers. I found that I could frustrate managers by destroying their drone 1/1/18 fight plans by outscoring them a few rounds. Plus it looks good for your ko ratio if you win a few decisions.
VH, low cuts. : I might try a lighter build now with counter being used more.
Flashers, Written by Albino:
FLASHERS: upside - quick & easy to manage and will usually only have short fps.
downside - one dimensional and cannot easily beat all fighter types. very difficult to beat fighters with KP and/or good CHN.
favored opponent - any fighter with low KP or low CHN
feared opponent - KP slugger, KP balanced
example fp-
1) 5H/11!/4 (inside);
2) 5H/11!/4 (allout);
2) towel;
towel will only kick in when you have less than 50% endurance. the more CND the more detail the fp can have.
how to make flashers:
30% STR, 10% KP, 20% SPD, 22% CHN, 18% AGL is a good distrubution (after you've designated height, cuts and CND. i like to start with about 6 CND, cuts always low. build will effect the average height of opponents (the taller they are the more 'counter' will hurt you), but i have no build preferance for flashers.
with any fighter you create, they don't have to be efficient till at least contenders. you can usually rely on the fact that most of your opponents will be easy to beat, so the efficient stats above don't necessarily have to be used. early in a flashers career he won't need a large CHN or high CND. CHN does have a limited effectiveness, after about 17-18 CHN you can absorb around 50% more stun damage than your opponent (if they have 11-12 CHN), after that you need to increase AGL to limit endurance damage and decrease opponents AGL advantage. later in the career a flasher he could have more AGL than CHN, the only exception being heavyweights. managing flashers:
--flashers vs flashers: its always tough when fighting you're own fighter type. if you have the better flasher, ie everything is in better proportions and/or your status is higher (more aps) then the less efficient you have to be. ultimately it's a guessing game, he can hide (1/1/18), play defensive (3H/6/11), be efficient (4H/8/8) or go aggressive (5H/10/5). you have to try guess what he will do, if he hides allout would be needed to KO him, but you don't want to allout a flasher; if he goes efficient then you will probably need to go efficient also. if you can cover his defensive & efficient option at the same time then you should win. inside will reduce your defences, so don't use it unless you have 5 point advantage or so. instead, if you have a SPD advantage use feint, if you don't then ring is probably your best option. ring may give you more fatigue, but the stun damage reduction at flasher damage levels is significant.
other options/tactics- working the body to tire your CND challenged opponent, eg 2B/3/15 or 3B/6/11. after 4 rounds or so he'll be tired enough for you to just go efficiently, and once he's tired you can't lose.
in heavyweights, weight advantage is a huge factor as CHN is the most important stat in flasher vs flasher matchups. without weight advantage you have less fatigue, using 2B/7/11 (using lower AGG to further reduce fatigue) till they tire may cause experienced managers to bail when their towel conditional unexpectedly kicks in from body damage and not fatigue.
--flashers vs KP dancers: you must be very careful, allout is a good option vs fighters with KP <= 2. after that though, allout can be beaten with an efficient counter. using inside is safer- but if they hide then you may not quite cause enough damage. this is when a calculator comes in handy, pure flashers are very mathematical to manage imo. if your allout can cover his 4H/6/10 (counter) tactic use allout then, only a very cunning opponent will use 4H/8/8 (counter) since 8 DEF is relatively easy to KO with inside. other options/tactics- hide or rest until you think he will open up, then KO him.
other options/tactics- if you have SPD => 15 and CND => 8 and you think he will hide then rest-dancing is an option. 6/2/5 (clinch) could win rounds while the rest points will help you hang around. after a few rounds your opponent will probably open up to KO a suspected tired opponent or in AGG to tak
Typical development for a 5'8" KP Balanced fighting in Super Welterweight (153 lbs). Main text by Albino.
STATUS 0
A new fighter
STR 10 KP 3
SPD 12 AGL 12
CHN 11 CND 13
STATUS 6
Low regional
STR 11 KP 3
SPD 13 AGL 15
CHN 12 CND 14
STATUS 12
Middle regional
STR 13 KP 4
SPD 16 AGL 17
CHN 13 CND 14
STATUS 18
High regional
STR 15 KP 5
SPD 18 AGL 19
CHN 15 CND 15
STATUS 24
Middle contender
STR 17 KP 5
SPD 21 AGL 22
CHN 15 CND 16
CHAMPION
of the world
STR 18 KP 6
SPD 22 AGL 24
CHN 16 CND 16
KP Balanced
Lets a start with design:
There are two major types. the ones will big chin and the ones without. I define big chin as CHN = 11 + KP/2. This amount of kp is ideal for going for round 1 KOs often with fighters that have 6 or more KP. Minimum chin for any fighter with 6 or more KP in contenders is 12.
After chin there are two different types:
The ones with SPD to slap or STR and AGL to work the body. It is paramount that you can fit your fighter into one of these two secondary groups, because if you can't and you can't flash KO either, then your fighter may as well be a punching bag. To slap, you SPD need only be the average of the division and you would fight similar to that way a KP dancer would. if you lack SPD and have STR and AGL, you are more endurance efficient so you can work the body until your opponent is not hiding then you flash them. When they work the body they must be efficient because they are only more efficient by a small margin.
Conditioning:
The more SPD the less CND. This is obvious since you could use lower AGG to land the same number of punches and take less fatigue. The endurance optioned fighters need 17 CND so they can go 5B/7/8 and take no fatigue. 5 AGG should win the round against hide tactics which is very important. If you are losing the round the opponent doesn't have to change what they are doing. Unless you are gaining a large endurance advantage on them you better win the round. Normally if you are losing rounds though, you can successfully flash them.
Instant Fight Plans (Not instant yet, you will have to Cut&Paste for the time being)
Tactics: Heres a sample of fp for the first 8 rounds (a kp fighter should have won by then). This would suit the speedier variety:
1) 6/1/13 (outside);
if roundslost > 0 then 8/1/11 (outside);
if roundslost > 1 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 4H/10!/6 (allout);
if endurance_percent < 100 - (round - 1) * 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 4H/10!/6 (allout);
5) 7/1/12 (outside);
if score < 2 then 9/1/10 (outside);
if score < 1 then 11/1/8 (outside);
if score < 1 and endurance_percent > 80 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if score < 0 and endurance_percent > 80 then 5H/10!/5 (allout);
if round = 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if round = 6 and endurance_percent < 75 then 1/1/8 (outside);
if round = 7 and endurance_percent > 75 then 6H/11!/3 (feint);
if round = 8 and endurance_percent < 75 then 1/1/8 (outside);
9)...
Its starts with slapping with 6 AGG. If you lose a round then you will slap harder. If you lose another round your opponent must be using pretty high AGG and must have low DEF (low enought for you at least) so you flash him. The endurance line is there to measure if your opponent is using 4B/8/8 or higher (so the '5' may not be a '5' in every matchup). If your opponent is using 4B/8/8 then you should be able to flash him.
From round 5 all AGG in slapping lines is increased by 1. This allows for fatigue and your opponent opening up to win rounds against you. This fp tries to maintain a large lead or 2 points. If your opponent is using enough AGG to beat you while you are going 9/1/10 (outside) then it will check your endurance and have a go at flashing him.
There are only two ways for "if score < 0 and endurance_percent > 80 then 5H/10!/5 (allout)" to kick in.
A) you didn't stun him - so allout...
B) he stunned you more than you stunned him, but it is very unlikely you would still be above 80% in that instance.
You may choose 85% to be safer or use additional conditionals but the likelyhood that line will kick is quite low, it's mainly a slapper stopper.
"if round = 5 and mystuns + hisstuns = 0 then 6H/11!/3 (feint)" is a nice line to close the box you put them in in the first rounds. In the first rounds you made sure they didn't win rounds and they didn't target your body, so they are either hiding or targeting the head. You know you were successful because this line only kicks in when there have been no stuns in the whole fight, if there where no stuns then you have contained them. This line is pre-emptive though and designed to catch them opening up because they have accomplished very little in the early rounds. For this reason you may choose to do this in round 6 instead of 5.
Two rest rounds follow. The round 6 rest is important because the pre-emptive flash line above it ensures a flash attempt occurs within the first 5 rounds, so if there is a round 6 there is a good possiblity that you are tired. "if round = 7 and endurance_percent > 75 then 6H/11!/3 (feint)" is very useful, but also risky. By round 7 your opponent should have opened up and there is a good chance for a 10-8 round if not a KO but this would be you second flash and that leaves the possiblity of you being very tired after it if it doesn't win you the fight. Even a 10-8 round could possibly win you enough points to go 1/1/18 for the remainder of the fight and still win.
Where does this leave the score? Let's assume you won the first fours rounds and you didn't flash. Say you win round five 10-8 because of the flash and you rest in round 6. Say you win round seven 10-9 and you rest in round 8. You are then 5 points up with 4 rounds to go. If you lose round 7, you will only be 2 points up and if you flash and get a 10-8 round you are up by 6.
Now lets assume you flashed in the early rounds based on endurance damage. The endurance line normally only kicks in in round two unless your opponent goes 6B/11/3 in round 2 or 3. Let's say they survive the flash somehow and you only win the round 10-8. you will go 6/1/13 until you lose a round and you will still open up and go 8/1/11. So let's say you lose an erly round too. You should be up by 3. The pre-emptive flash doesnt happen and you go 7/1/12. Say you win that round and the opponent opens up the next round and you need to rest. The score is still 3. Your opponent is winning rounds so the round 7 flash would be great to have here but say you don't and you still go 7/1/12 and draw the round. In round 8, you aren't tired enough so you slap again. you still have a decent lead.
Keep in mind any of these 10-8 rounds could have resulted in a KO victory, I was just showing where it leaves you if you couldn't KO them. It leaves you in the lead.
So you see this fp works best against the conservitive while being conservitive itself. All flash lines are only triggered when it is determined their DEF must be low, except for the pre-emptive flash in round 5 which only serves to catch the conservative. The radical will normally fall victim to the round 7 flash because by that time they have gambled and opened up to try and win the fight and left their DEF low. They may use stun checks and not expect a second flash.
Posted by: Powerlille /CCCP/
Thanks, Sanford. We will move all this to the new site soon.
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Posted by: Vault 13
I think alot of this is uncomprehensible for the regular rookie
Posted by: Powerlille /CCCP/
yyyyyyyep
Posted by: Jimmy the Harp (Little Gym)
"PS 2 : This demonstration also works for End Damage (O Kp) sluggers. This was originally posted by Duke in the design forum about one year ago"
Can anyone explain what he means that this also works for 0 kp sluggers? I don't understand what this stun efficiency formula has to do with 0 kp sluggers...
Posted by: SIN <Evil Empire>
I think what it is trying to say is that calculating endurance damage for 0kp sluggers is basically the same as calculating stun damage for kp sluggers.
Endurance damage is basically calculated the same as stun damage except in stun damage kp (and targeting) plays a factor.